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Post by Random on Mar 4, 2007 5:32:10 GMT -5
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Post by Archagon on Mar 4, 2007 6:51:03 GMT -5
Nice fuckin' trailer!
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Post by Monolith on Mar 4, 2007 18:17:42 GMT -5
From what I've heard, it's basically WOW with an emphasis on PvP combat. It seems the races are tied together as well, so it'll be orcs vs dwarves, dark versus light elves, and chaos vs empire (the matchups that were in the trailer). There's been nothing to indicate that you will be able to break away from this, but I think it would be utterly stupid not to allow such interaction between all races. Very nice trailer, but there's a newer one that was playing at GenCon SoCal, which again showed an empire priest getting his ass handed to him.
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Post by Blues on Mar 4, 2007 18:26:54 GMT -5
I should note that my resident Taylor brought this up. anyway, he says that there is no allowed interaction with any people who aren't on your team. Empire cannot talk to Dwarves, etc. Like different servers or something. Also, if someone on Empire tries to talk to Chaos, it will go though, but it'll be gibberish, supposedly.
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Post by Random on Mar 4, 2007 19:02:19 GMT -5
thats really stupid
its ok when its just like two sides or something but with the warhammer universe thats like, what. . . at least 6 sides, and thats if they don't include some of the races
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Post by Arachis on Mar 4, 2007 20:49:33 GMT -5
splitting everyone up like that does sounds pretty stupid.
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Post by Monolith on Mar 11, 2007 19:49:41 GMT -5
Dude, what did Terrance do to you? It's like every other line is shameless praise.
On topic, the game has a bit of promise, but the fact that the race you choose determines what you'll be fighting for the entire time you play as it seems like it will make things get old very, very fast. As far as gameplay, my more MMO minded aquaintances have said it plays almost exctly like WOW from the demos present at Gencon SoCal. That's not to say it isn't without merrit, the war mechanic seems very solid assuming it's propperly ballanced, and the WOW system is popular for a reason. It's just that the issues I mentioned above seem to hurt the gameplay unnecessarily with no real benefit, other than maybe less work for the developers having to work on interacial mechanics.
Either way, it's not the kind of game most of us here get excited about. Phantasy Star Universe is the only MMO I'll pay for, call me closed minded or whatnot. Most of the others have gameplay that drags and gets boring for me too quickly. I'm mostly an action/fighting/FPS gamer who plays a few RPGs on the side.
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Post by Random on Mar 11, 2007 20:38:04 GMT -5
PSU is not horribly bitchin' once you play a bit of it. . . the expansion they've announced has potential mostly because they seem to plan on bringing back many aspects of PSO, thats about it.
As far as WAR goes, there had better be a LOT of variation for each class. The way they're making it, you're pretty much buying the game and then choosing to play 1/6 or 1/3 of it depending how you look at it. To a Dwarf player, nothing concerning empire or elves means anything at all because theres absolutely no interaction. As such, as far as any one player is concerned, there will only be 4 classes, which is insufficient if you ask me, even if they're heavily customizable.
As far as conflicts between varying factions in warhammer goes, gamesworshop has repeatedly shown in the past that they have absolutely no problems coming up with a random story to justify any group fighting any other. Dawn of War for example, while 40k, is still pretty much the same thing.
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Post by Monolith on Mar 11, 2007 22:19:09 GMT -5
Like random said (and trust us, we've both played the Warhammer miniatures game off which WH online is based for a significant number of years) the races do battle each other outside of the Warhammer online pairings very frequently as far as fluff goes. Either way, it would not be hard to simply provide another area for the good races to meet each other and battle the evil races together. Since they already have isolated battlegrounds, why not put in one that's a free for all where any race can go? You'd still have the good races and evil races on their prosepctive sides, but it would allow for a more global dynamic in the game and make it seem much less like the developers are just being lazy.
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Post by Random on Mar 11, 2007 22:51:46 GMT -5
And add a system by which other players that're on your overall side (order/disorder) can help out undermanned groups when possible instead of dogs of war.
Not to mention, have in addition to the systems already in place, a monthly tournament type thing in which all players can participate in a fight that is order vs. disorder and takes place on some neutral ground somewhere, and then gives the winning side some small almost meaningless global buff like a minor increase in HP/MP regen.
Lastly, I'm not sure if this is how they're doing chaos, but if its 100% only tzeentch I am going to be incredibly pissed off. How can these companies that're making warhammer games keep just ignoring that fact that chaos already has an amazing system that no one would even have to spend 5 minutes adapting to the game. MARKS DAMMIT. Dawn of War doesn't have them (and it'd be even EASIER to implement there), and if WAR doesn't either, well, I'm going to be disapointed. It'd be so easy and cool stylistically (wouldn't it be sweet to have all those choices for what your character looks like? they all look cool!) that I simply cannot understand why that kind of thing isn't in the game.
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Post by Arachis on Mar 11, 2007 23:06:31 GMT -5
Its probablly more of a balance issue. Balancing one team against only one other team means that each side can have a vast variety of interesting weaknesses and strengths, allowing for interesting pvp combat. If all the races were mingled together, then I can think of only one of 2 options:
all of the evil races would have to have pretty much the same abilities as each other (unlikely considering the differences between each race)
all of the races have only simple rock paper scissors like abilities, which would make pvp more about finding your best matchup than the actual combat itself. (This is how WoW's PvP works and also what makes it frustrating, if nobody plays the rock to your scissors.)
I think that WHO is trying to seperate itself by having a good PvP system, but that in doing so, they are sacrificing some of the other gameplay.
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Post by Random on Mar 11, 2007 23:28:30 GMT -5
I disagree, because it would be really easy to make it so you have access to a lot of abilities but either 1. your single character cannot actually know them all or 2. you get them all eventually but you have to pick a select few abilities to take into combat and you can't switch them outside of your town.
Using those kinds of systems each class could vary greatly, sometimes having strengths against some enemies, sometimes having strengths against others.
Having it just be one on one does indeed make it easier for the designers, but honestly, thats just flat out lazy. They've got a good idea here but I don't think they're taking it quite far enough
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Post by Arachis on Mar 11, 2007 23:43:56 GMT -5
No matter how well you design each race, I still think its possible to create a more interesting and subtle pvp combat when its only one team against the other. Whether or not they actually created a good 1on1 pvp system is another question completely.
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Post by Monolith on Mar 12, 2007 0:10:24 GMT -5
No matter how well you design each race, I still think its possible to create a more interesting and subtle pvp combat when its only one team against the other. Whether or not they actually created a good 1on1 pvp system is another question completely. There's a reason nobody makes a miniatures game that way, or a fighting game like that either. It gets very old very fast as tactics become predictable. It also defeats the purpose of even having an MMO, which is to enable global interaction. To me, it seems like a crappy idea whatever way you look at it.
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Post by Arachis on Mar 12, 2007 0:22:13 GMT -5
I guess when you look at it that way. Have you noticed though how miniatures games a) take forever? and b) dont usually work as well when its 1v1v1 or 2v2 or whatever?
Maybe Im dreaming too much of a really good online fighting game that will never exist.
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